New Rules Regarding Entities

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SgtSpike

Site Admin & Server Owner
Staff member
New Rules Regarding Entities

1) Any farms (iron, XP, etc) that push mobs into a tight area MUST be actively farmed. If a player is standing AFK next to such a farm, the farm must auto-kill all mobs going through it. Mobs will no longer be allowed to gather up in the same small area while the player stand idly by.
2) Players will have 5 days to convert their existing farms into farms that will auto-kill or auto-harvest. After this point, moderators may step in to auto-kill the mobs for you by placing lava in strategic positions. You can feel free to reverse this change with a redesigned harvester that meets the above qualifications.
3) Animals will be limited to 25 per chunk, and a maximum of 250 in a visible area.
4) Moderators will be free to slaughter any and all animals if your animal farms exceed this number.

I am open to changes to these rules, but I needed to come up with something so that all moderators and players are on the same page. Please keep discussion civil. :)
 

Vannicke

That guy, you know, with the face?
Laptop touchpad + nickel on the button + bottle of soda

Technically still not legal by the rules I think, but it won't lag the server :p
 

JCN

New Member
Well well.. I knew it was bad, but this bad?!

Just today I saw some ViP idiot in chat yapping about how he pops off to watch youtube for half an
hour at a time while his xp grinder stacks mobs. (why must I pay for him?) He even stated that the server didnt like it.
He dont care.
Yesterday I saw liddiemac practically bragging about how she nearly got banned because of
a grossly overpopulated auto chicken breeder farm. They already know the rules. They are kids.
Look at the ban list... They just break rules as a matter of principal. Why must I suffer because of them?
To punish the responsible farmers and xp grinder users so brutally as to say NO MORE to all of it is just sad.
We want cake. Not half a crumb.

Admitting that mods will go as far as literally griefing all member's farm with lava or just appearing
and killing them all every last single animal without mentioning a single thing to the player is nice
that you're open about it but all the same.. quite sad, aggressive even. Your mods ban players for
doing that you know. Now you're expecting them to do it to us? It's okay.. I dont take offence.

I've worked for ages on a certain farm and kept to all rules. I have asked frequently yourself
and mods what the details are on farms and XP grinds without any definate answer. Because I'm aware
of what vicious trolls some of the mods can be on this matter and that I'm quite positive
you couldnt care less about anyone's farm or xp grind and have told them off record to "have fun with controling it"
Go ahead and deny it. I wont believe you. Why would I? You admited it above.
The last question i asked you in game was "what would be the freaky E# max stack of
mobs for a quad spawner spalsh potion XP grind?" You "Said hang.." on then vanished for days >.>

Every xp grind I saw involves a stack of mobs. I see there are no threats to ban anyone who breaks this rule
only that one or two of your "special" mods will have a happy fun time killing folks's farms and xp grinds
and mob spawners and griefing them or banning them if they complain.
Even if the majority of the mods would not like having to do this for you, some of them will definately
enjoy it. I have had this said like this. "If you dont reduce your sheep a mod will come and do it for you, viciously"
I know how far some of your mods will go to enforce your rules. You might as well replace
all your nice mods with jerks if that's your goal.

"Mobs will no longer be allowed to gather up in the same area" suggests it's been far far too long since you actually
played the game for .. well playing the game. NOT bitcoins.
You are perhaps too interested in players who want to earn bitcoins by diggy hole.
The game is not about that for so many players. XP grinds are a part of the game.
Enchants, repairs, twinking. Our gear is #1 in all games that have gear.
You sound like you think we should have to be all scrubs because your server is too ...stretched .. to host any better.
Farming is massive part of the game. I shouldnt have to remind you of this. Your new limitations are inconsiderate
without more specifics and your lava grief threats are inappropriate towards responsible farmers.

The dire problem is that too many mindless preteen kids occupy your server to the
point you have to ruin it for the adults by griefing us even if we pay to play on your
server. Is that not a bit.. strange to you? Or that' your bitcoins junk is clogging up the server and you're trying, desperately I might add,
to reduce bandwidth use elsewhere? What next tree farms with 5 tree cap because of block update leaf despawn issues?
I do not know the reason for your new unreasonable terms of use. They are just begging to be broken by everyone on the server.
Getting aggressive with us if we dont comply reveals more about you personally than you should show or that you
fear we will all laugh at your new rules. I'm sorry if I seem a bit too frank. You were very frank with us in the post.

Maybe you should stop counting bitcoins and try playing minecraft instead.
If I'm right there.. Let the server be more hosted for the game minecraft and not clogged up
and choked to death by bitcoins data counting and ridiculous terms for spawners and farms use.
You think that's a fair request? I think that's a pretty fair request really.

I do not like your new rules at all and I'm sure you couldnt care less if the rest of the entire server
finds it ridiculous also. You're on a mission for commision acquisition.. or hosting a Minecraft server?
What, tell us pls. I cant tell. Give us back the game and stop pinching and getting your attack dogs
to bite us if we dont comply. It's sad, depressing even.

Please have some patience with my obvious disappointment. I just spent most of
a week tieing 4 dungeon spawners into one XP grind. It's a dream come true and
your new rule now makes it just an arrows grinder. ;( Auto kill methods dont return
XP as far as I am aware. I always limited the mob stack to 130 as it returns 30
xp levels exactly. I never afk. I was hoping to make it a public XP grind warp and now what
use would that be except to get the user banned or my grinder destroyed?
I appreciate what you do to make it all smooth for all kinds of players all the time.
The members list is all lit up with donors and (paid with bitcoins ... doh) sponsors.~

I hope you will accept my appology if any offence was taken by mocking these new rules.
With much laughter.. and some tears. I have always complied with mods enforcing your rules, even when those rules were not even written anywhere on the rules section. I guess now that they are written there folks will laf and laf and laf at anyone who farms XP for enchants or paid loads of diamonds for double XP grinders. "but my mushroom island was too remote to get trolled.. who killed all my totally hidden cows?" /silence /chuckle
I sent you my sponsorship few nights ago six weeks in advance just to proove to you how happy I am. I'm sure you know I like this server. Can you PLEASE be more specific on
"You'll all just have to rework your farms or not even bother with animals and XP grinders or I'll send troll mods. You have 5 days.. k thx bia" post.

I know it;s a new rule and still being worked on as you suggested by the "i'm open to suggestoins" and that you expected it may cause an uproar with the "please keep it civil" Sorry if this really long whiney noise response seems uncivil :) I dont mean to annoy. Only to hopefull say some stuff others might want to but dont have the brass ones for the cheek of it. SgtSpike, your rule is fair even if you have to send the dogs of war out to enforce it. Can there be some flexibility on it though.. more refined details?


(Oh, may I suggest a new higher rank than sponsor who can chip in a fair amout more than
5o dollars.. or just under it monthly. I've seen other servers offer this and lo and behold there are the rank name colors in the online list. (snip, no advertising for other servers please) has a 30 dollar a month rank.
with nuts perks. Is it so much to ask? I'm quite used to good old whip out your visa for win.
Anything beats getting beat up by attack dogs :/ Give us immunity from this crap!

How about banning the error spamming addons or fatty bandwidth greedy ones?
I have seen mods kick members with a message to relog cos of error spam. Reducing this
with more attention to what mods players use would be productive? I use no mods or addons, I'm not sure if this reduces my load on the server vs someone who does use addons.
If it does then that would surely be a bandwidth saving option? Frankly.. Everyone should play with a clean instal IMO.

More reasonable specifics in this rule like..

Rank earns you not just personal warps and TP but farming / mob grinder cap limit increase.
Guest 70 E# limit XP Grinder
20 E# limit farm.

ViP 90 E# limit XP
25 E# limit farm

ViP+ 110 E# limit XP
30 limit farm.. and so on...

High population server times = No mob grinders or animal farms activity allowed?

It costs nothing but the ink used to type it on the screen. It saves grief and
applies more flexibility to the rule. It helps mods maintain good mojo for themself
as the rules are very clear and u$er friendly for all.

Is that not cool? It's like.. more bait for more donors. The more donors you get the more cash in your pocket or the better the server you can own. Do you see that winning? I see that being reasonable and win for all.

I thank you VERY much for reading and considering this long post.
 

DrMadFellow

I'm out, come find me elsewhere.
INSERT LONG RANT.

I don't think you understand the purpose of these rules. People creating those massive farms where thousands of animals pool into a small area actually SLOWS the server down. We aren't doing this because it amuses us (if anything it creates more work than we should have to deal with). Even if just one player is running one of these massive afk farms it can slow the server as much as 30% or more, so imagine dozens of players owning these (which they currently do). Frankly I was rooting for the automated version of this that simply doesn't allow that many mobs in one chunk, but I haven't talked to hac to see why he chose a manually enforced option instead.

Your farm is not ruined anyways, so long as you are actively at your farm killing things and not letting them massively pool, it is still an xp farm, a simple solution would be to install a switch that opens your farm floor to lava when you are not there, so there is no risk of animals pooling while you are not using it.

Beyond this point you rambled far too much on nothing in particular for me to have any further response. As always (since im not "the nice guy" on these forums) I remind you that you are not entitled to anything on this server, regardless of donator status or involvement. All staff involved in the server (exception of sgtspike) do not recieve ANY benefit for their time, and finally that if you are truly ever upset about any policy, I think sgtspike, myself, eagle, and hacattack, all have a VERY good track record of listening to and addressing concerns.
 

JCN

New Member
There's really no chance of the xp grinder (s) ever building stacks with nobody there to aggro the spawners?
It's really remote and not far off bedrock. Thank you for your response and for reminding me I'm just a guest
regardless of rank. I understand a bit more about the rules now that you have provided more light on why.
Idiots that needed to make cow farms so mind blowing massively big that they drain the server by as much as 30%.
Humpties that went off AFK to watch Dora DVDs while right next to a double spawner stacking away.. 4 numbers E# when return.

Fair enough. Never done that, never will.

So you're saying a 100 sheep over a 4 chunk wide partitioned enclosure is safe,
and that you're saying 130 mob cap at a quad/tripple spawner is fine as long as user never afks or lets it
go over 30 lvls XP worth of mobs is fine?! Really? SgtSpikes Post appears to say all XP grinds must have an auto
kill function but I dont see why it would need one if it's only spawning while someone is there?
If they plan to go afk any member should just warp to home or log out.
I dont ever AFK anything like that. So why would an XP grind need an auto kill?

I thought we were not allowed to AFK grinders. Ever.

With regard to farm animal entity caps I have always checked about that even
before the mods knew what it was, I was asking.
I already asked mods of two seperate occasions to verify my sheep farm was within
the 30/chunk limit and it is not a problem. Sarite seems to think it is okay and so does Chuffmaster. I'll reduce them to 25/chunk today. I have a cow
farm bordering maybe 60 cows in a roughly 2 chunk wide area but yes they love to
mob in corners. Wooden fences just create more corners :/ I will try to solve that.
Are there really people on the server that have 1000s of cows or sheep roaming around together? That's monstrous >.< I was worried about 60 cows jees.
 

FrothingLuck

Most Disliked Since 2015!
If this rule gets overturned, I better not see a single forum thread pop up complaining about lag. As for JCN, are you okay? You seem to be have touched by the crazy stick.
 

BoureySR85

Member
Alrighty....I have a question I'm sure some people will want answers for.....

1) Any farms (iron, XP, etc) that push mobs into a tight area MUST be actively farmed. If a player is standing AFK next to such a farm, the farm must auto-kill all mobs going through it. Mobs will no longer be allowed to gather up in the same small area while the player stand idly by.
Alright. SO how will this apply to Iron farms? The only "mobs" in most of these will be the 30-ish, villagers, "in the box". And maybe a few scattered for timing and such... All golems are killed as soon as they reach the bottom (usually).
So will these "Iron Trench" type of farms be permitted?
I don't wanna waste my time building one just to find out we will not allow it anymore....
I know some people believe that all "mods" just do whatever, because honestly who enforces the enforcer? I try to stay within the bounds that I ask regular players to adhere by.


As for the
(paid with bitcoins ... doh) sponsors.~
remark....I work hard for my money, not all of "us" are kids who can only earn money with Bitcoins.
And as for the "bitcoin program" slowing or influencing the server load....you need to do more research.
We use Hawkeye for logging everything players do as a way to combat Griefing.
This is our "front-line defense" against people who only intend to cause problems.
Our "Bitcoin Program" as we call it, is nothing but a script that is ran that checks these "Already Written" Log files.
Hence with or without the Bitcoin program our lag stays the same.

And further more, when we have people "relog" its because NoCheat is showing us alerts that they could be trying to hack, and upon checking out the player, we try to have the player relog
so we can try to tell if its just a "lag" issue or if they are actually trying to use a "fly mod" ,for example. A lot of times, when I first joined the mod team; I thought whatever the No-cheat alert said was true...
and almost banned innocent players, when all the time it was just lag....

As for any "Client Side" addons....they cannot affect the server in anyway. It's not possible.


I know this was a lil long and drawn-out....but I try to talk to people who have concerns. As sometimes I have these same concerns....
So nobody take anything I said as an attack. I am only trying to explain, what the other fellow Staff are just exhausted from trying to explain since servers began...
 

BoureySR85

Member
New Rules Regarding Entities

1) Any farms (iron, XP, etc) that push mobs into a tight area MUST be actively farmed. If a player is standing AFK next to such a farm, the farm must auto-kill all mobs going through it. Mobs will no longer be allowed to gather up in the same small area while the player stand idly by.
2) Players will have 5 days to convert their existing farms into farms that will auto-kill or auto-harvest. After this point, moderators may step in to auto-kill the mobs for you by placing lava in strategic positions. You can feel free to reverse this change with a redesigned harvester that meets the above qualifications.
3) Animals will be limited to 25 per chunk, and a maximum of 250 in a visible area.
4) Moderators will be free to slaughter any and all animals if your animal farms exceed this number.

I am open to changes to these rules, but I needed to come up with something so that all moderators and players are on the same page. Please keep discussion civil. :)
Alright, even tho, this sounds to some like Moses handing down another set of tablets.... I tend to receive things in a lighter light....plus I also imagine this...


*I've been waiting forever to be able to use this pic*:rofl:

I don't care who you are....that is funny. :x3:
Right BML? >.>
 

Stevie3939

Active Member
Hello SgtSpike, what happens if we get caught going afk at our spawner? what kind of penalty do we get for first attempt, second attempt, and so on? thank you for your time reading this ;)
 

YerOfficeBuddy

If you're a rat, I've got a 9 for that
I'd ice my cow and sheep farms myself, but they are not interact-able! :mad:
I'll find a way though...i always find a way :cool:
 

SgtSpike

Site Admin & Server Owner
Staff member
JCN, it seems you have a grave misunderstanding of why these rules are being put in place and what will happen with them.

First off, moderators will not be griefing your harvesters by putting lava all over them. They will be placing one block of lava in a strategic position (I am picturing on the floor somewhere along the path of the harvester) to kill mobs. They will only do this if you do not implement a solution to auto-kill mobs yourself. And the solution to auto-kill doesn't mean you cannot manually kill them for the XP either, it just means that they must be killed automatically if a player isn't actively killing them.

Secondly, this isn't something I enjoy doing. But players are becoming upset that we have to randomly kill their animals or mobs to reduce lag on the server. Rather than having mods be responsible for de-lagging the server by finding groups of mobs or animals that are too large and killing them all, I would like to see players take responsibility by creating harvesters and farms that won't group up mobs and lag the server. It is possible, it just means that the player has to be actively killing the mobs instead of waiting for them to gather up and killing them all at once.

Thirdly, if you have any problems with any actions of moderators, I greatly encourage you to come directly to me about it, rather than making vague accusations against them in threads like this. That sort of talk is completely useless, and only serves to divide the community. I do make sure that moderators who do not uphold the rules of the server are dealt with appropriately.

Fourthly, I am not sure why you have a problem with our Bitcoin promotion. It adds zero lag to the game. Every block interaction is tracked regardless of whether I would be paying Bitcoins for it or not, simply because we want to track griefers and be able to roll back any damage they cause. I know that many of the players on the server couldn't care less about Bitcoins, and that is perfectly fine for me. I am not trying to push those players away, or cater only to the Bitcoin crowd.

Fifthly (is that a word?), I think your 4-spawner find is awesome. I just know you can actively harvest those mobs instead of waiting for them to gather up and harvesting them all at once.

Sixthly, the rules are subject to change, if a more appropriate solution is found. The goal is to have mobs and animals be a non-existant problem as far as lag goes. So, we cannot have mobs gathering up in one block, and we cannot have too many animals in the same location. Allowing higher-donating members to have higher limits might be something we can do in the future, but right now, we have no way to know how many mobs are in the same space, and an excess of them will still cause server lag, regardless of donators status. At this point, I literally cannot buy a faster server, no matter how much money I had, because the main Minecraft processes are limited to a single core of the processor. I could run our server on the world's fastest supercomputer and it would actually be slower, because it has a lower per-core speed.

********

DrMad - I would like to implement a limiting functionality for entities (it's really the ideal solution), but hac is still AFK and we really need to do something now about this. If we can get an auto-limit plugin in place in the future, then it would likely eliminate the need for the rules above.

********

Stevie - you can go AFK next to your harvester all you want, I don't care, but it must have an auto-kill function. Mobs cannot be allowed to gather up on top of each other in the same block.

********

Bourey - Iron farms will not be allowed, unless they can be designed in such a way that all of the villagers are separated or have space to roam. Having the mobs in one place uses a lot of server CPU.

********

For anyone wondering what I mean by an auto-kill harvester, I'll try to explain in more detail.

Picture a spawner. The spawner funnels mobs into a tunnel of water. At the end of the tunnel is a glass block that causes them to gather up. This is where your current kill zone is.

Now picture the following modifications to the harvester. Instead of the glass block being the end of your harvester, you create another tunnel to the left. The water continues to flow, and at the end of the new tunnel to the left is a pocket of lava. So, mobs are carried to their death (eventually). You still have the glass block (or better yet, a glass wall), meaning you can still kill them as they float by, gaining the XP and drops, but you must be actively killing them in order to gain those. You can't wait for them to gather up, because they'll simply drop into the lava if you don't kill them.

I don't care if you want to set a mouse-macro that auto-clicks for you so you can go AFK and still gain XP from it. That's fine. I just don't want to see mobs gathered up into the same square again.
 

CollinstheClown

Retired old coot
So for iron golem farms, if went from this:


To something like this:



Would that be acceptable? I'd hate to lose the farm I just build.
 

SgtSpike

Site Admin & Server Owner
Staff member
Having them in their own separate block is ideal, but even your first design isn't too much of a problem. I wouldn't want to see them all in the same square is all, or packed in enough that they are constantly bouncing off each other.
 

dmkuhar

Pronounced with a 'Umpty'
So, if I have a standard farm, with decent sized fenced-in areas and animals that I breed legitimately, that's fine so long as I keep the numbers below a certain point - am I reading that right?
 

jhupp85

Pixelated since birth.
Thanks for implementing these limits. I've been having issues simply building or mining with ease due to the crazy lag. CC is one of the most populated servers I've ever played in. I don't feel there is anything unreasonable about some rules on mobs within a given chunk.

and I don't know where the bitcoin argument came from... I'm definitely not in this game for the BTC. I'm in it for my friggin' awesome city-town. I'd like to be able to expand said city-town without lag because somebody wanted a million chickens and eggs.
 

BMD86

I mine and build and stuff!
This just isn't making since to me. I know when people go AFK at there spawners and that is not when I lag. It is when there are too many animals in a small area. IDK why this is but I always stop lagging after someone kills the access animals, not kills the mobs in there grinders.
 
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